Saturday, January 07, 2006

Gun Pairs

Rivrdog has a post up about a set of paired pistol and pistol-caliber carbine he's going to be testing.

I LOVE the idea of a sidearm and longarm sharing ammo; it's even better if they share magazines. Especially in a SHTF scenario.

Unfortunately, I've not executed that idea very well here in my house. Why? Expense.

Looking to myself first, because I'm the gun nut in this house... *g*... I've had my Colt .45ACP for a LONG time. That's my carry gun probably 90% of the time. The only carbine I know of (Gentle Readers, feel free to comment on anything I've overlooked - PLEASE!) that shares ammo and mags with that pistol is the Ruger Camp Carbine .45, which Ruger ceased production on for some unknown reason. And which now sells for north of $500. So, my SHTF rifle is my $85 SKS - which I happen to like quite well.

Lisa's pistol of choice is the Ruger P85 9mm I inherited from Dad... and which she (unsurprisingly to me) scored 246 out of a possible 250 with in her CCW class. Yeah, as long as she's got it handy, I'm not too worried about her being mugged, assaulted, raped, or murdered. Bigger concern is the civil lawsuits that will be filed against us by the dead goblin's family.

But again, pistol-caliber carbines that take that magazine ain't cheap. And she also likes my inherited M1 Carbine pretty damn well, and shoots it quite well. So I'm not in any hurry to spend multiple hundreds of dollars to replace a rifle she likes, just to get the ammo and mag commonality.

Now, if I were starting from scratch, and had to fill all the checkboxes in my "Classes of guns we need to have for each of us", I'd be more willing to spend the $$ on compatible firearms. But, I started with some, picked up some others for super cheap, and at the moment can't justify the money to replace one good gun with another, just to achieve ammo/mag compatibility.

I may go ahead and do so in the future, and in fact I'd like to, but since all of our NEEDS (except for a shotgun Lisa likes) are currently filled, I have a hard time spending our limited discretionary income on gun WANTS.

Maybe that makes me a bad gunblogger - but hey, for right now, our shooting budget goes to ammo. Still need to get Lisa a shottie she likes, but that will likely take some more research.


Blogger og said...

SKS and Colt 45 are a good choice regardless. That's what's in mine.

On the other hand, the Thomson Submachine gun is also chambered for Colt 45.

7:24 AM  
Blogger David said...

As far as I'm concerned, variety makes for good gunblogging -- you have more to write about!

Ruger sells a PC9 carbine that I believe takes their 9mm magazines, but yeah, it's not cheap.

And you do know about the Mech Tech carbine conversion unit that turns your 1911 into a carbine, right? Get one of those and a second 1911 and you're set.

1:18 PM  
Blogger Aaron Neal said...

David, yeah, I've seen the MechTech conversion kit.

Problem is, it gives me (IIRC), a choice between disabling my sidearm for about $200, or spending about $200 to diable a different $500 sidaarm

Magazine interchangability is a good idea for SHTF guns. Interchangability of recievers is nice, but not practical in a SHTF scenario, since you have to disable one gun to make the other one work.

10:13 PM  
Blogger Rivrdog said...

The best combos seem to involve the Kel-Tec carbine, called "Sub Rifle 2000"

Kel-Tec will sell you a Sub-rifle with the following magazine configuration:

The SUB-2000 is available in the following versions only:
9mm: Glock 17, Glock 19, S&W 59, Beretta 92, SIG 226

.40 Cal: Glock 22, S&W 4006, Beretta 96, SIG 226

That's a pretty wide choice, and since a "street price" runs about $300, you aren't going to do much better.

I have the Glock 23/.40 SW&W version of the Sub-rifle, and since the Glock 23 is a compact, the 15-round magazines that go in the Sub-Rifle fit into the pistol, but stick out about an inch. No problem. My SHTF configuration is one 13-round magazine in the pistol, and 4 15 and 2 29 round magazines in the vest with the Sub-Rifle slung on the shoulder. That gives me almost 120 rounds for a battle load for the rifle, plus 14 in the pistol to keep the close-range enemy off of me while I do other vital battlefield tasks.

S&W model 59's or 659's are available quite reasonably for around $400 on auction, and their full-size maggy fits in a model of the Sub-Rifle. For at total of $800, including extra magazines (there is a 30-rounder made that fits S&W actions) and ammo, you are ready to take the field with decent gear.

If you are recent ex-military, and learned the Beretta 92 pistol, get one of those and a Sub-Rifle. Your total will probably top $1,000, but you'll be using a pistol that you carried in the military, and that counts for a lot.

BTW, my Camp 45 is T/U right now, something failed in the trigger group and the trigger doesn't engage the sear, but since I don't have a manual to take down the trigger group yet, it sits in pieces in my shop. That puts my 1911A1/Camp 45 pair out of action.

I still have two good pairs: the above Glock/Kel-Tec combo and the old standbys, Snubby and Snuffy, the Ruger SP-101 and Marlin 1894C in .357.

For a non-matched battle pair, the 1911A1 and my 12ga Mdl 37 Ithaca pump S/G are hard to beat, or the 1911A1 and the Cetme Model C battle rifle, or, or, or (Damn, that's a big AND full safe!)

11:34 PM  
Blogger Rivrdog said...

On the spendy side, but coming down is the plastic-fantastic Beretta Storm CX-4, which uses Beretta M-92 maggys.

I've recently seen Storms for $650.

There's still persistent rumors of a Storm in .45ACP, might be closer than we think, then it would mate with their .45 pistol, which is a top contender for the Army's new pistol that they want to buy with their quick-purchase mode. The G.I.s in Iraq have been demanding .45ACP since the hop-head jihadis don't go down well with less than 3-5 rounds out of a Beretta into the K-5, but a single .45 round WILL stop them.

11:40 PM  

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